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alpine-devel

Re: [alpine-devel] Code of Conduct

From: 7heo <7heo_at_mail.com>
Date: Fri, 12 May 2017 03:36:46 +0200

One small change on the new point 3, mostly to simplify it and not to
contradict the first sentence with the rest of the point:

Alpine (AKA Alpine-Linux and Alpine-OS) Code of Conduct (CoC)
=============================================================

1. This CoC is to provide community guidelines for creating and
enforcing a safe, respectful, productive, and collaborative place for
any person who is willing to contribute in a safe, respectful,
productive and collaborative way. It is especially not meant as an
exhaustive law, to automate moderation, or to prevent thinking.

2. A safe, respectful, productive and collaborative environment is free
of personal attacks, doxing, and disparaging remarks of any kind,
including, but not limited to, racial, ethnic, gender-related,
religious, political, sexual-orientation related slur.

3. This CoC does not condone nor excuse censorship; or the exclusion of
those acting in good faith. Censorship should never happen unless
required by law.

4. Any sustained disruption of the collaborative space (mailing lists,
IRC etc.) or other Alpine events shall be construed as a violation of
this CoC and appropriate action will be taken by the Alpine community
moderators.

5. Any amendment made to this CoC should be approved unanimously by all
Alpine developers (i.e. all people who have commit rights on the
repositories).

6. The CoC is only about interaction with the Alpine community. Your
private and public lives outside of the Alpine community are your own.
Any issue arising outside of the Alpine community and not directly
technically related with the Alpine maintained software shall neither be
discussed nor arbitrated within the community.


On 5/12/2017 3:20 AM, 7heo wrote:
> Thank you Shiz for taking the time to review and comment on my proposal.
>
> Since you started with clause 3, I will step right in, and say: from the
> feedback I got, it is utterly clear that it completely misses the point.
> So I will entirely rephrase it (not using any of the suggestions because
> they are more a confirmation of step 2 - do not offend others - than
> what was actually meant by - do not get offended).
>
> About step 4, you are right that it is important to explicitly state
> that actions will be taken "with a response appropriately proportional
> to the fault."; but examples are out-of-scope: they call for more
> exhaustive specifications in the CoC, while this is what we want to
> avoid (it will take more time and we, AFAICT, prefer to trust the
> developers as a whole than to write a canonical document that will be
> interpreted according to who shouts louder).
>
> For point two, exactly for the same reason as for point four, we do not
> want explicit listings (and let's not give potential ill-intended people
> a complete todo list), but I will add 'doxing' as it apparently makes
> consensus.
>
> The 'and' in point 6 is very much intentional. It means that we will
> only care about stuff happening outside of the community if it is
> technical.
>
> Finally, point 5 does not define alpine moderators, because we have no
> other definition for it than the developers. So I guess that will have
> to be an amendment for later on.
>
> ----
>
> So here is the new version:
>
> Alpine (AKA Alpine-Linux and Alpine-OS) Code of Conduct (CoC)
> =============================================================
>
> 1. This CoC is to provide community guidelines for creating and
> enforcing a safe, respectful, productive, and collaborative place for
> any person who is willing to contribute in a safe, respectful,
> productive and collaborative way. It is especially not meant as an
> exhaustive law, to automate moderation, or to prevent thinking.
>
> 2. A safe, respectful, productive and collaborative environment is free
> of personal attacks, doxing, and disparaging remarks of any kind,
> including, but not limited to, racial, ethnic, gender-related,
> religious, political, sexual-orientation related slur.
>
> 3. This document is not about censorship or exclusion. Censorship is an
> extreme measure, and shall only happen as a consequence of applicable
> state law. Exclusion should be decided unanimously by the developers (or
> in case of exclusion of a developer, by the developers who are in the
> project for longer than the person to be excluded).
>
> 4. Any sustained disruption of the collaborative space (mailing lists,
> IRC etc.) or other Alpine events shall be construed as a violation of
> this CoC and appropriate action will be taken by the Alpine community
> moderators.
>
> 5. Any amendment made to this CoC should be approved unanimously by all
> Alpine developers (i.e. all people who have commit rights on the
> repositories).
>
> 6. The CoC is only about interaction with the Alpine community. Your
> private and public lives outside of the Alpine community are your own.
> Any issue arising outside of the Alpine community and not directly
> technically related with the Alpine maintained software shall neither be
> discussed nor arbitrated within the community.
>
> On 5/12/2017 2:21 AM, Shiz wrote:
>> Hi Theo,
>>
>> First, thanks for doing this — I believe that adopting a CoC will help us
>> provide handles to those in the community who see or are subject to
>> abusive
>> behaviour to address them in a safe and productive manner.
>>
>> There’s two (not too fundamental) issues I see with your current
>> proposal:
>>
>> 1) The wording of clause 3. While I understand what you’re trying to say,
>> the way it is being said seems far from neutral (and possibly
>> wrong, as
>> I’m sure under a lot of circumstances I would be considered a “social
>> justice warrior”, as well many people that would want to contribute to
>> Alpine), needlessly scaring people off in this especially charged
>> political climate. I believe this section could be reworded in a far
>> more neutral manner while still preserving its intention, maybe
>> like this:
>>
>> “This document is to be used as stated in clause 1 for the health
>> of the
>> community, not as a beating stick for other people. Please assume the
>> best intentions of people to a reasonable degree, and try to talk out
>> differences first — sometimes people simply misunderstand each
>> other.”
>>
>> I see William also proposed another variant on IRC that I may like
>> even
>> better:
>>
>> "Participants may disagree on the methods or opinions of others,
>> but it
>> is important to maintain the assumption of good faith. Alpine is
>> a diverse
>> project representing many viewpoints, and as such, disagreements
>> are likely
>> to occur. It should be assumed that all participants are working
>> for the
>> advancement of the project.”
>>
>> Where I’d possibly append “ and community” to the last sentence.
>> 2) Clause 4 currently lacks examples of appropriate actions that can
>> be taken
>> by the community. I think it’s important to at least note the scope
>> of these
>> actions, so people realise that it is serious and can lead to more
>> than
>> simply a slap on the wrist. Maybe adding an additional clause with
>> something
>> like the following text may help elaborate on that:
>>
>> “Appropriate measures depend on the nature and severity of the case in
>> question and may range from, but are not limited to, official
>> warnings to
>> temporary or permanent exclusion from community communication
>> channels and
>> removal of developer status or other conferred privileges.”
>>
>> And a few mostly random, smaller thoughts:
>> * Maybe clause 2 should be expanded a bit to not just include direct
>> personal
>> attacks but also situations like harassment, stalking, and doxxing;
>> * I’d change the “and” in clause 6 to and or, as harassment behaviour
>> within the
>> Alpine community may not directly pertain to Alpine-related
>> software. In my
>> opinion it should relate to both the community and the software that
>> arises
>> from it.
>> * Clause 5 nicely defines Alpine developers, but we have no such
>> definition yet
>> for Alpine community moderators. Maybe adding a simple one would be
>> helpful
>> for people to identify who to address complaints to?
>>
>> Again, thanks for doing this, and I hope we can have an inclusive but
>> concise
>> CoC at the end. :)
>>
>> - Shiz
>>
>>> On 12 May 2017, at 00:49, 7heo <7heo_at_mail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hey people,
>>>
>>> a few of us have been discussing every now and then the possibility
>>> of ever needing a CoC.
>>>
>>> Following an exchange of opinions with some of the long-time Alpine
>>> developers today, I decided to come up with a CoC asap, for two reasons:
>>>
>>> 1. Abuses in the community would have an objective ground to be
>>> fought on.
>>> 2. Nobody could then come claiming we do not have a CoC and present
>>> us with a much more harmful and complex alternative (as it has been
>>> the case in many open source projects already)
>>>
>>> Here goes my proposal (followed by explanations for each point),
>>> loosely based on the proposals from the PostgreSQL mailing list:
>>>
>>> Alpine (AKA Alpine-Linux and Alpine-OS) Code of Conduct (CoC)
>>> =============================================================
>>>
>>> 1. This CoC is to provide community guidelines for creating and
>>> enforcing a safe, respectful, productive, and collaborative place for
>>> any person who is willing to contribute in a safe, respectful,
>>> productive and collaborative way.
>>>
>>> 2. A safe, respectful, productive and collaborative environment is
>>> free of personal attacks and disparaging remarks of any kind,
>>> including, but not limited to, racial, ethnic, gender-related,
>>> religious, political, sexual-orientation related slur.
>>>
>>> 3. This CoC is not about being offended, nor giving weapons to so
>>> called social justice warriors. One should always assume good
>>> intentions. As with any diverse community, anyone would otherwise
>>> eventually get offended at something.
>>>
>>> 4. Any sustained disruption of the collaborative space (mailing
>>> lists, IRC etc.) or other Alpine events shall be construed as a
>>> violation of this CoC and appropriate action will be taken by the
>>> Alpine community moderators.
>>>
>>> 5. Any amendment made to this CoC should be approved by all Alpine
>>> developers (i.e. all people who have commit rights on the repositories).
>>>
>>> 6. The CoC is only about interaction with the Alpine community. Your
>>> private and public lives outside of the Alpine community are your
>>> own. Any issue arising outside of the Alpine community and not
>>> directly technically related with the Alpine maintained software
>>> shall neither be discussed nor arbitrated within the community.
>>>
>>> ----
>>>
>>> Explanations:
>>>
>>> 1. Alpine is about contribution first, community second. The
>>> community only exists for the sole purpose of contributing together
>>> to Alpine. Not the other way around.
>>>
>>> 2. Such an contribution-welcoming environment can only happen when
>>> people leave their personal different at the door. Toxic behavior
>>> (like personal attacks) have no place in our community. i.e.: "Your
>>> work sucks" is fine while "you suck" isn't.
>>>
>>> 3. The FOSS community has recently seen a drastic increase of
>>> lobbying for exclusion, and censoring attempts, against some
>>> contributors, from certain groups. Offensive and toxic behavior
>>> within the community will be dealt with according to point two.
>>> Offensive and toxic behavior outside of it will be ignored according
>>> to point six.
>>>
>>> 4. As explained in point one, the main and foremost goal of our
>>> community is to support contribution. Anything threatening or
>>> impeding contribution is therefore directly harming the primary goal
>>> of our mailing lists and IRC channels; and has to be prevented.
>>>
>>> 5. Again, as explained in point one, the goal of the community is
>>> contribution. This CoC, discussing it, and all the work related to it
>>> are wasted time in regards to the technical progress. This
>>> requirement is meant as a discussion deterrent, as it will be
>>> pointless to discuss any proposal to the CoC as soon as one developer
>>> disagrees.
>>>
>>> 6. We do not care if you torture kittens or beat up puppies outside
>>> of our community. As long as you are keeping things separated, we will.
>>>
>>> ----
>>>
>>> I hope I made it well enough that we do not have to spend too much
>>> time discussing it.
>>>
>>> Theo.
>>>
>>>
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>>> ---
>>>
>>
>
>
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>


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Received on Fri May 12 2017 - 03:36:46 UTC