Hi,
On Wed, 21 Dec 2016 10:06:34 -0200
Alba Pompeo <albapompeo@gmail.com> wrote:
> The Alpine Aarch64 image need a different bootloader to work.> Alpine's default is Syslinux but it doesn't support aarch64.> What are the options for the specific architecture (aarch64)?> I see GRUB2 supports it, but it's an awful and bloated bootloader.> Doesn't fit Alpine.>> I have no experience with Das U-Boot but it seems to support Aarch64.> https://github.com/u-boot/u-boot/blob/master/doc/README.arm64
Yes, u-boot is used as native ROM bootloader on some aarch64 platforms.
Though, seems UEFI for aarch64 is not supported. Which is required on
some platforms.
> Or can just wait for Syslinux to port it?> http://www.syslinux.org/archives/2016-August/025340.html> > Any other options?
Not really. Efilinux is limited, and gummiboot is discontinued.
We have grub2 in testing. I also tested that grub-efi boot mode works
on x86_64. Clandmeter tested it to work on aarch64. This might be an
option to use for the time being for UEFI boot.
Syslinux would be nice, but as said it's unlikely to support aarch64
for a while.
Currently we use:
- syslinux for x86/x86_64
- rpi native on raspberry pi (arm)
- u-boot on all other arm
We probably should add:
- u-boot for aarch64 boards we want/need to support
- UEFI boot possibly using grub2
So this is more diverse than wanted. The good thing in u-boot is that
it can read syslinux.cfg files and they can share the boot config.
Or do we have any other options for UEFI boot?
/Timo
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I did some counting.
SYSLINUX
========
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Language files blank comment
code
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C 731 25328 35531
142385
C/C++ Header 445 7954 15848
43594
HTML 3 3540 11
7902
Assembly 55 1048 2300
5268
Pascal 30 609 20
4825
make 59 920 945
2596
Perl 22 318 351
1575
xBase Header 7 308 844
1212
Python 1 34 6
267
Bourne Shell 7 40 17
183
Lua 2 21 5
170
CSS 2 18 0
105
Bourne Again Shell 2 22 20
79
XML 1 0 0
39
Windows Resource File 1 2 0
24
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SUM: 1368 40162 55898
210224
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
U-BOOT
======
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Language files blank comment code
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C 3817 170112 236909 852193
C/C++ Header 3600 71859 118800 498002
Assembly 279 7530 14630 31028
Python 95 3694 7710 10479
Perl 6 1405 1117 8020
make 942 2160 6642 7851
Bourne Shell 29 360 556 1847
C++ 1 209 57 1532
yacc 1 104 25 604
NAnt script 1 90 0 359
lex 1 40 12 311
YAML 1 12 25 279
Markdown 1 80 0 278
Bourne Again Shell 1 32 24 103
DOS Batch 2 8 0 94
CSS 2 22 11 84
Kermit 3 4 20 83
Tcl/Tk 1 5 7 28
sed 2 1 29 24
INI 1 2 0 9
XSLT 1 0 1 9
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SUM: 8787 257729 386575 1413217
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
GRUB2
=====
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Language files blank
comment code
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C 827 39895
31816 234238
C/C++ Header 470 8076
15359 40827
m4 113 1056
1176 15380
Assembly 166 3149
6584 10209
TeX 1 699
2824 5436
Windows Module Definition 3 622
21 3365
make 8 619
365 2090
Bourne Shell 10 109
417 1448
Python 3 168
212 1373
sed 10 20
1 423
lex 1 54
34 305
yacc 1 44
44 268
diff 4 24
117 143
C++ 1 8
17 80
awk 1 6
16 76
Lisp 1 3
0 50
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SUM: 1620 54552
59003 315711
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
GUMMIBOOT
=========
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Language files blank comment code
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C 9 900 303 4196
make 1 34 25 144
m4 2 27 10 131
XML 1 23 13 101
C/C++ Header 6 38 90 83
Bourne Shell 2 12 18 49
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SUM: 21 1034 459 4704
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LILO
====
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Language files blank comment code
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C 19 1702 558 11821
Assembly 21 1683 2627 9178
HTML 34 131 67 5701
TeX 8 550 394 3238
C/C++ Header 22 532 787 1379
Perl 4 262 356 1295
Bourne Again Shell 1 87 34 578
make 9 176 128 556
Bourne Shell 10 70 142 303
CSS 2 9 4 280
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SUM: 130 5202 5097 34329
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ELILO
=====
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Language files blank comment code
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C 46 2746 3715 10905
C/C++ Header 35 792 1643 2969
Assembly 5 89 407 430
make 8 111 213 184
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SUM: 94 3738 5978 14488
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
On Thu, Dec 22, 2016 at 4:39 AM, Timo Teras <timo.teras@iki.fi> wrote:
> Hi,>> On Wed, 21 Dec 2016 10:06:34 -0200> Alba Pompeo <albapompeo@gmail.com> wrote:>>> The Alpine Aarch64 image need a different bootloader to work.>> Alpine's default is Syslinux but it doesn't support aarch64.>> What are the options for the specific architecture (aarch64)?>> I see GRUB2 supports it, but it's an awful and bloated bootloader.>> Doesn't fit Alpine.>>>> I have no experience with Das U-Boot but it seems to support Aarch64.>> https://github.com/u-boot/u-boot/blob/master/doc/README.arm64>> Yes, u-boot is used as native ROM bootloader on some aarch64 platforms.> Though, seems UEFI for aarch64 is not supported. Which is required on> some platforms.>>> Or can just wait for Syslinux to port it?>> http://www.syslinux.org/archives/2016-August/025340.html>>>> Any other options?>> Not really. Efilinux is limited, and gummiboot is discontinued.>> We have grub2 in testing. I also tested that grub-efi boot mode works> on x86_64. Clandmeter tested it to work on aarch64. This might be an> option to use for the time being for UEFI boot.>> Syslinux would be nice, but as said it's unlikely to support aarch64> for a while.>> Currently we use:> - syslinux for x86/x86_64> - rpi native on raspberry pi (arm)> - u-boot on all other arm>> We probably should add:> - u-boot for aarch64 boards we want/need to support> - UEFI boot possibly using grub2>> So this is more diverse than wanted. The good thing in u-boot is that> it can read syslinux.cfg files and they can share the boot config.>> Or do we have any other options for UEFI boot?>> /Timo
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Better formatting. http://sprunge.us/JINJ
I think (E)LILO and GUMMIBOOT should be used where possible.
Platforms that don't support it could use SYSLINUX.
For platforms that don't support any of those, GRUB2.
And U-BOOT just as last resort.
I always heard GRUB2 was an abomination and superhuge, but it's "just"
150% the size of SYSLINUX.
People could say that because they looked at the source code and it's
really bad?
I'm just doing some counting......
On Mon, Jan 2, 2017 at 12:29 PM, Alba Pompeo <albapompeo@gmail.com> wrote:
> I did some counting.>> SYSLINUX> ========> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Language files blank comment> code> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------> C 731 25328 35531> 142385> C/C++ Header 445 7954 15848> 43594> HTML 3 3540 11> 7902> Assembly 55 1048 2300> 5268> Pascal 30 609 20> 4825> make 59 920 945> 2596> Perl 22 318 351> 1575> xBase Header 7 308 844> 1212> Python 1 34 6> 267> Bourne Shell 7 40 17> 183> Lua 2 21 5> 170> CSS 2 18 0> 105> Bourne Again Shell 2 22 20> 79> XML 1 0 0> 39> Windows Resource File 1 2 0> 24> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------> SUM: 1368 40162 55898> 210224> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> U-BOOT> ======> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Language files blank comment code> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------> C 3817 170112 236909 852193> C/C++ Header 3600 71859 118800 498002> Assembly 279 7530 14630 31028> Python 95 3694 7710 10479> Perl 6 1405 1117 8020> make 942 2160 6642 7851> Bourne Shell 29 360 556 1847> C++ 1 209 57 1532> yacc 1 104 25 604> NAnt script 1 90 0 359> lex 1 40 12 311> YAML 1 12 25 279> Markdown 1 80 0 278> Bourne Again Shell 1 32 24 103> DOS Batch 2 8 0 94> CSS 2 22 11 84> Kermit 3 4 20 83> Tcl/Tk 1 5 7 28> sed 2 1 29 24> INI 1 2 0 9> XSLT 1 0 1 9> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------> SUM: 8787 257729 386575 1413217> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> GRUB2> =====> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Language files blank> comment code> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> C 827 39895> 31816 234238> C/C++ Header 470 8076> 15359 40827> m4 113 1056> 1176 15380> Assembly 166 3149> 6584 10209> TeX 1 699> 2824 5436> Windows Module Definition 3 622> 21 3365> make 8 619> 365 2090> Bourne Shell 10 109> 417 1448> Python 3 168> 212 1373> sed 10 20> 1 423> lex 1 54> 34 305> yacc 1 44> 44 268> diff 4 24> 117 143> C++ 1 8> 17 80> awk 1 6> 16 76> Lisp 1 3> 0 50> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> SUM: 1620 54552> 59003 315711> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> GUMMIBOOT> =========> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Language files blank comment code> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------> C 9 900 303 4196> make 1 34 25 144> m4 2 27 10 131> XML 1 23 13 101> C/C++ Header 6 38 90 83> Bourne Shell 2 12 18 49> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------> SUM: 21 1034 459 4704> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> LILO> ====> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Language files blank comment code> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------> C 19 1702 558 11821> Assembly 21 1683 2627 9178> HTML 34 131 67 5701> TeX 8 550 394 3238> C/C++ Header 22 532 787 1379> Perl 4 262 356 1295> Bourne Again Shell 1 87 34 578> make 9 176 128 556> Bourne Shell 10 70 142 303> CSS 2 9 4 280> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------> SUM: 130 5202 5097 34329> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> ELILO> =====> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Language files blank comment code> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------> C 46 2746 3715 10905> C/C++ Header 35 792 1643 2969> Assembly 5 89 407 430> make 8 111 213 184> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------> SUM: 94 3738 5978 14488> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> On Thu, Dec 22, 2016 at 4:39 AM, Timo Teras <timo.teras@iki.fi> wrote:>> Hi,>>>> On Wed, 21 Dec 2016 10:06:34 -0200>> Alba Pompeo <albapompeo@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>> The Alpine Aarch64 image need a different bootloader to work.>>> Alpine's default is Syslinux but it doesn't support aarch64.>>> What are the options for the specific architecture (aarch64)?>>> I see GRUB2 supports it, but it's an awful and bloated bootloader.>>> Doesn't fit Alpine.>>>>>> I have no experience with Das U-Boot but it seems to support Aarch64.>>> https://github.com/u-boot/u-boot/blob/master/doc/README.arm64>>>> Yes, u-boot is used as native ROM bootloader on some aarch64 platforms.>> Though, seems UEFI for aarch64 is not supported. Which is required on>> some platforms.>>>>> Or can just wait for Syslinux to port it?>>> http://www.syslinux.org/archives/2016-August/025340.html>>>>>> Any other options?>>>> Not really. Efilinux is limited, and gummiboot is discontinued.>>>> We have grub2 in testing. I also tested that grub-efi boot mode works>> on x86_64. Clandmeter tested it to work on aarch64. This might be an>> option to use for the time being for UEFI boot.>>>> Syslinux would be nice, but as said it's unlikely to support aarch64>> for a while.>>>> Currently we use:>> - syslinux for x86/x86_64>> - rpi native on raspberry pi (arm)>> - u-boot on all other arm>>>> We probably should add:>> - u-boot for aarch64 boards we want/need to support>> - UEFI boot possibly using grub2>>>> So this is more diverse than wanted. The good thing in u-boot is that>> it can read syslinux.cfg files and they can share the boot config.>>>> Or do we have any other options for UEFI boot?>>>> /Timo
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You're right.
I'll wait to see what you discover after you study the source code more deeply.
Thanks!
OpenWrt has a page on bootloaders.
https://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/bootloader
On Mon, Jan 2, 2017 at 12:51 PM, Timo Teras <timo.teras@iki.fi> wrote:
> On Mon, 2 Jan 2017 12:35:04 -0200> Alba Pompeo <albapompeo@gmail.com> wrote:>>> Better formatting. http://sprunge.us/JINJ>>>> I think (E)LILO and GUMMIBOOT should be used where possible.>> Gummiboot [1] and ELILO [2] are abandoned and should not be used.>>> Platforms that don't support it could use SYSLINUX.>> For platforms that don't support any of those, GRUB2.>> And U-BOOT just as last resort.>>>> I always heard GRUB2 was an abomination and superhuge, but it's "just">> 150% the size of SYSLINUX.>> People could say that because they looked at the source code and it's>> really bad?>> I'm just doing some counting......>> Comparing just lines of code is not accurate. For example in case of> u-boot it contains hardware level support for gazillion of CPUs and> peripherals. Only fraction of that is compiled based on the> configuration.>> I do not have strong opinion on GRUB2/SYSLINUX. I should probably look> at the code form one... :)>> Cheers,> Timo>> [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gummiboot_(software)> [2] https://sourceforge.net/projects/elilo/
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Found an interesting one. Qi.
Qi is a lightweight replacement for the uBoot bootloader with
everything that doesn't assist "loading" and "booting" Linux stripped
out.
https://github.com/radekp/qi
On Mon, Jan 2, 2017 at 1:36 PM, Alba Pompeo <albapompeo@gmail.com> wrote:
> You're right.> I'll wait to see what you discover after you study the source code more deeply.> Thanks!>> OpenWrt has a page on bootloaders.> https://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/bootloader>>>>> On Mon, Jan 2, 2017 at 12:51 PM, Timo Teras <timo.teras@iki.fi> wrote:>> On Mon, 2 Jan 2017 12:35:04 -0200>> Alba Pompeo <albapompeo@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>> Better formatting. http://sprunge.us/JINJ>>>>>> I think (E)LILO and GUMMIBOOT should be used where possible.>>>> Gummiboot [1] and ELILO [2] are abandoned and should not be used.>>>>> Platforms that don't support it could use SYSLINUX.>>> For platforms that don't support any of those, GRUB2.>>> And U-BOOT just as last resort.>>>>>> I always heard GRUB2 was an abomination and superhuge, but it's "just">>> 150% the size of SYSLINUX.>>> People could say that because they looked at the source code and it's>>> really bad?>>> I'm just doing some counting......>>>> Comparing just lines of code is not accurate. For example in case of>> u-boot it contains hardware level support for gazillion of CPUs and>> peripherals. Only fraction of that is compiled based on the>> configuration.>>>> I do not have strong opinion on GRUB2/SYSLINUX. I should probably look>> at the code form one... :)>>>> Cheers,>> Timo>>>> [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gummiboot_(software)>> [2] https://sourceforge.net/projects/elilo/
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Alba Pompeo wrote:
> Better formatting. http://sprunge.us/JINJ
This is interesting.
> I always heard GRUB2 was an abomination and superhuge, but it's "just"> 150% the size of SYSLINUX.> People could say that because they looked at the source code and it's> really bad?> I'm just doing some counting......
GRUB2 is huge because it tries to do more than a bootloader should.
"GRUB2 is the Eclipse of bootloaders". Also configuring it is painful
and I never figured it out, using front-ends to solve problems.
On the other hand, SYSLINUX is configured with one text file
with sane syntax.
LOC don't matter here. "If it sucks, it sucks".
Cág
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On Mon, 2 Jan 2017 12:35:04 -0200
Alba Pompeo <albapompeo@gmail.com> wrote:
> Better formatting. http://sprunge.us/JINJ> > I think (E)LILO and GUMMIBOOT should be used where possible.
Gummiboot [1] and ELILO [2] are abandoned and should not be used.
> Platforms that don't support it could use SYSLINUX.> For platforms that don't support any of those, GRUB2.> And U-BOOT just as last resort.> > I always heard GRUB2 was an abomination and superhuge, but it's "just"> 150% the size of SYSLINUX.> People could say that because they looked at the source code and it's> really bad?> I'm just doing some counting......
Comparing just lines of code is not accurate. For example in case of
u-boot it contains hardware level support for gazillion of CPUs and
peripherals. Only fraction of that is compiled based on the
configuration.
I do not have strong opinion on GRUB2/SYSLINUX. I should probably look
at the code form one... :)
Cheers,
Timo
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gummiboot_(software)
[2] https://sourceforge.net/projects/elilo/
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