Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2020 09:37:02 +0000
In-Reply-To: <56714871.TiyEYPsqlG@localhost>
References: <20200419090413.GA4104@kiwi.home> <2af23d66-1a00-85be-6d6d-a4b24c39192c@c3f.net> <20200420211647.GA13172@redacted> <56714871.TiyEYPsqlG@localhost>
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Subject: Re: mailing lists, processes, modernization
To: ~alpine/devel@lists.alpinelinux.org,Ariadne Conill <ariadne@dereferenced.org>,j3s <j3s@c3f.net>,Consus <consus@ftml.net>
CC: Wolf <wolf@wolfsden.cz>,David Demelier <markand@malikania.fr>
From: Rasmus Thomsen <oss@cogitri.dev>
Message-ID: <9DE76A0B-2D5C-4466-B354-8A02180FDDA8@cogitri.dev>



On April 21, 2020 6:22:56 AM UTC, Ariadne Conill <ariadne@dereferenced=2Eo=
rg> wrote:
>Hello,
>
>On Monday, April 20, 2020 3:16:47 PM MDT Consus wrote:
>> On Mon, Apr 20, 2020 at 03:38:23PM -0500, j3s wrote:
>> > Please tell me if I'm overstepping, but as a (very happy) Alpine
>user, I
>> > feel obligated to speak up here=2E
>> >=20
>> > On 4/20/20 2:23 PM, Ariadne Conill wrote:
>> > > Well, the problem is that we do not own our own support
>> > > pipeline right now=2E  Yes, there is the mailing lists, but almost
>> > > nobody is using them=2E  Instead, they go to third-party websites
>> > > like StackExchange=2E  We would like to own our support
>> > > pipeline, so that we can ensure it continues to exist regardless
>> > > of what happens to some otherwise unrelated company=2E
>> >=20
>> > My opinion is that this isn't going to happen regardless of the
>software
>> > that the Alpine project sets up=2E People like StackExchange, and if
>those
>> > users were interested in hearing from the Alpine folks, they'd
>probably be
>> > using the mailing list today=2E
>
>There are many people in the Alpine community that post on
>StackExchange and similar websites=2E  People *do* want to hear
>from "the Alpine folks," just not in the form of e-mail=2E
>
>> > Currently, it takes 3 clicks and two distinct webpages to get to
>the
>> > support mailing list=2E I bet that having a "support" header on your
>home
>> > page that provides a mailto: link would drive as many people to the
>> > mailing list as standing up Discourse would=2E
>
>I really doubt it=2E  Interacting with mailing lists is inconvenient,
>and the Sourcehut software has exacerbated that inconvenience
>by being incompatible with the most commonly used e-mail
>clients in 2020 (namely the ones built into your phone), due to
>Drew's decision to fight political battles and use our mailing
>lists (as well as anyone else who uses Sourcehut's mailing lists)
>as a weapon in that fight=2E
>
>If the mailing lists were unpopular in the ezmlm/mlmmj days, they
>are basically terminally ill at this point=2E

Yes, the reply rate on our MLs is rather low for most mails (well, basical=
ly all but the ones where we discuss shutting the ML down=2E=2E=2E)=2E I pe=
rsonally don't see a future for the MLs either=2E

Regards,

Rasmus