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Subject: Re: Building community/cargo, build-edge-x86_64 is stuck
From: Jakub Jirutka <jakub@jirutka.cz>
In-Reply-To: <CA+T2pCE0TpbvdLqAchxHhDpJpnfck-jNM9Gj+fVipStONBxygQ@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 18:07:49 +0100
Cc: alpine-infra@alpinelinux.org
Message-Id: <59E82379-9E96-4660-92B2-C595A947852E@jirutka.cz>
References: <700B1EC2-05EB-433D-B8CA-886DDF4CAE70@jirutka.cz> <CA+T2pCE-B2P_Js=hc+X-UjvptJTMizX_nUZ4szzBodHZLi3Ktg@mail.gmail.com> <CB840A20-A016-4344-9F26-5AEDCEC26C93@jirutka.cz> <CA+T2pCE0TpbvdLqAchxHhDpJpnfck-jNM9Gj+fVipStONBxygQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: William Pitcock <nenolod@dereferenced.org>,
 Natanael Copa <ncopa@alpinelinux.org>,
 Timo Teras <timo.teras@iki.fi>


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> If this is the case, then it, too, is no longer policy compliant.

Said who? These policies are (still) not written anywhere, so I follow =
what I was told by competent people like ncopa or fabled.

> Manual intervention on the builders does not seem like a good idea to =
me, which is probably why it=E2=80=99s not compliant with policy.

I agree, but I haven=E2=80=99t created this approach.

> I suspect the ghc-bootstrap package was dropped because of the =
depsolver bug I solved back in April.
> The bootstrap package would have a provides entry for the compiler =
with a version of 0.
> This would allow the real compiler to always =E2=80=9Ewin" the =
preference.

No, it was dropped because it was partially broken (I reviewed it) and =
actually not used (per fabled). I remember that quite well, =E2=80=99cause=
 I wasted amount of time trying to figure out how does it work, to be =
then told it=E2=80=99s not used at all.

> Instead, lets solve these problems correctly, please.

The problem is that I don=E2=80=99t know what is the correct solution. =
That=E2=80=99s why I asked ncopa or fabled.

> Indeed, the only thing we have learned today is that Haskell is also =
broken.

And maybe even gcc, =E2=80=99cause it also depends on itself=E2=80=A6 Or =
you have just wrong information. gcc is also handled somehow specially, =
if I remember correctly what fabled told me.

So please, don=E2=80=99t interfere into it and wait for reaction from =
ncopa or fabled.

Jakub

> On 30. Oct 2017, at 17:53, William Pitcock <nenolod@dereferenced.org> =
wrote:
>=20
> Hello,
>=20
> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 11:39 AM, Jakub Jirutka <jakub@jirutka.cz> =
wrote:
>>> A manual intervention on each builder is not an acceptable solution.
>>> Policy requires that builds be reproducible, in other words, that =
they can build with `abuild rootbld`.
>>> So this change should not have been pushed to begin with.
>>=20
>>=20
>> No, I thought this too, but it=E2=80=99s not how it really works. See =
below.
>>=20
>>> Look at the haskell + cabal packaging for inspiration, it is a =
similar situation, and is policy compliant.
>>=20
>> Have *you* looked at ghc (haskell) package? I did some time ago (and =
now), tried hard to figure out how does it build. There is =
`makedepends_build=3D"$pkgname"`, so it depends on itself. There used to =
be package ghc-bootstrap, but it was not used anymore (and even that =
couldn=E2=80=99t work without manual intervention). I asked fabled about =
it and he explained me that ghc-bootstrap was only temporary for initial =
bootstrap, now ghc depends on itself and it must be probably manually =
installed on the builder when bootstrapping.
>=20
> I did some time ago, when we had ghc-bootstrap package.
> If this is the case, then it, too, is no longer policy compliant.
>=20
>> The same situation is community/rust. I even mentioned this in my =
email.
>=20
> The same situation of being policy non-compliant?
>=20
>> Unfortunately the bootstrapping (and cross-compilation) process is =
still not documented anywhere, so I can refer only to information that I =
was told by more competent people like fabled.
>=20
> Manual intervention on the builders does not seem like a good idea to
> me, which is probably why it's not compliant with policy.
>=20
> I suspect the ghc-bootstrap package was dropped because of the
> depsolver bug I solved back in April.
> The bootstrap package would have a provides entry for the compiler
> with a version of 0.
> This would allow the real compiler to always "win" the preference.
>=20
>>> A solution would be to take a copy of the cargo package from =
distfiles.alpinelinux.org
>>=20
>> This is actually a good idea. I can keep it as it was before, just =
use our cargo binary instead of now non-existence binary from the =
upstream.
>=20
> You could do that, or what I was inferring was that the binary itself
> was still available on distfiles.alpinelinux.org.
> All the builders copy their sources to that server.
>=20
>> fabled or ncopa, could you please explain how is ghc and similar =
packages handled? Ideally directly on wiki, or just via email and I will =
copy it to wiki.
>=20
> Instead, lets solve these problems correctly, please.
> Indeed, the only thing we have learned today is that Haskell is also =
broken.
>=20
> William
>=20


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