Received: from mail-lj1-f171.google.com (mail-lj1-f171.google.com [209.85.208.171]) by nld3-dev1.alpinelinux.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DB7B0781901 for ; Wed, 22 Jan 2020 00:44:17 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-lj1-f171.google.com with SMTP id a13so4816276ljm.10 for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2020 16:44:17 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=zbygXy9uwPMlfKhVuH07pbi+KgTnU0YIhCUGvlHBXQk=; b=sEYBEQJqMjgLeq6d24rsr3WENX3+OtVQNKbtHt2abNqiHoGXcvEg0VYE1rDceHZC5L H7aZRUAtnl3g0HqdnC2JxUcFsf/eAKQ7CxBUy+ZhF6TPQkqZt7TbdrUWq+jCQG0Uo5Ip hHPLQ1FDXenyxpzn4XndzNwCBc+OTKMitZJw6qC/aO4pSefsuZChrXrAPUIWC0kLL7md gw6nl4mDaIvM3KqSNBKY3QcvdSldZAXxz3Dqd3+jph1JdnEAw6rVcLOq01P+nAIPe3Or mw1aOPV1h6Zlj/oJK8yEYBD6cnj66S2HtVhqnOhGL4NDz+n6EgEHhUFKetp1TD1146Uq P6Fw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=zbygXy9uwPMlfKhVuH07pbi+KgTnU0YIhCUGvlHBXQk=; b=AHSsFLKi6djreUDIZzFYf4a61tX73rtnElti8l9zGTAc7f/kXKMxhcJbiqzNVlV3d3 a4QE8PLWNKBnesoTJ5Ighjg8TZZ+9G5/i3uPGjv3v1/crkCmu095UeG+o5g7st+yfTAN E9+eksliuuxDqaK4GuRNCy50Drp+7pG1M2lDR2tEJDmgXUlbDdeqj80jrCbWm1nQKHUb qKUUMQ6Ch4tjxnFR4VBZu/z4XEYA9NALg6qbJ2a07XjzqRTlgmtnhDd7/242GYhx/oZn DtLMlfJZixckE+RfiLFz4N7b1+cttBFzQvRbS6/Dv6Vq9LJmJJIzarlOgHBfzN79QRLu uALw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVHOPyPJxaxcT80aLJ3UtRDf84aS8fp0Tv3ola4BODW4JkiqPwD tz5GelQiSIudnKtkPuf3S8WefIeakeYHck2Y7/y59LztwKY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzsn00m0Lvvu1gb2kJnCwWWGc+e56xXXlcbU68aOeV50qT7ypPnyPY5teCkNbv3gYOHsgTNKj46wPyH2A4C97I= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:9a01:: with SMTP id o1mr18068001lji.247.1579653856602; Tue, 21 Jan 2020 16:44:16 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <34c3e716403eef2db137991da905522e@dereferenced.org> In-Reply-To: From: PICCORO McKAY Lenz Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2020 20:44:05 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: TDE desktop added support for muslc.. able to build in alpine To: alpine-user Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000fdaee4059cafd206" --000000000000fdaee4059cafd206 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable El mar., 21 de ene. de 2020 a la(s) 19:51, Ariadne Conill ( ariadne@dereferenced.org) escribi=C3=B3: > I mean: why don't you take Alpine and build a desktop distribution > on top of it? > still too much work.. i try to make this more easyle.. and if you only are all the alpine staff seem rest of the mail sais only one thing.. alpine only works good for dockers and embebed systems? too simple are less easy and more work to more complex solutions.. i remenber starting point.. "too simple" was the alpine reasons to make a new distribution from LEAF .. here comes. and now "too simple" are the same reason to not make some kind of evolution? incredible! >> XFCE was moved to community because of our desire to reduce the size of > >> the main distribution repository. > > > > it makes sense thanks for the info.. why that are not public in the new= s > channel at the web page? > > Most people enable the community repository as it is. In most cases, > this is an absolutely boring change. Therefore there is nothing really > to discuss about it. > > >> Many packages in main have been moved > >> over time to community. This is simply because we would like main to > >> reflect a small core distribution. > > so seems alpine are not for end users.. blind persons cannot install.. > > seems the about page must be updated so.. still said "general purpose" > > Alpine is for end users who are comfortable with basic system > administration > tasks. It is not an alternative to Ubuntu, Fedora or any of those kinds > of distributions. The primary benefits to using Alpine (lack of systemd, > musl C library, hardened toolchain, advanced package management) are > really only realized by users who have some pre-existing knowledge. > > Considering Alpine is installed using text mode and screen readers work > best in text mode, I suspect that Alpine is actually quite easy for a > blind person to install. > > But as I have mentioned, a "user friendly" variant of Alpine may be good > for somebody to do, much in the way that Ubuntu is a "user friendly" form > of Debian. > > >> Alpine largely prefers to stick to the essentials and let downstream > >> spins handle things like this. > > umm makes sense.. thaks for that info. so are nto suitable to desktops > end users and daily work? > > It is suitable for those who want a proper workstation environment, > and have the capability to bring it up. Alpine is not intended to be > something like Ubuntu or openSUSE where everything is handled for you. > > If you want something with more handholding, Void or Adelie may fill > those niches, but they are only tangentially related to Alpine. > > > > >> In some cases, it is beneficial for Alpine to sync > >> up with what downstream consumers are doing, but that isn't a hard > >> requirement. > > but it's beneficial.. remenber that it's better to grow a little rather > than fall into lack of > > manpowers.. > > It is not necessarily beneficial. Focusing on desktop is certainly > not beneficial to Alpine itself, as we would rather let downstream > spins focus on that. > > Ariadne > --000000000000fdaee4059cafd206 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

El mar., 21 de ene. de 2= 020 a la(s) 19:51, Ariadne Conill (ariadne@dereferenced.org) escribi=C3=B3:
I mean: why don't you take Alpine and build a desktop distribution
on top of it?
still too much work.. i try to make this= more easyle.. and if you only are all the alpine staff seem rest of the ma= il sais only one thing.. alpine only works good for dockers and embebed sys= tems?

too simple are less easy and more work to mo= re complex solutions..=C2=A0

i remenber starting p= oint.. "too simple" was the alpine reasons to make a new distribu= tion from=C2=A0LEAF=C2=A0..= here comes. and now "too simple" are the same reason to not make= some kind of evolution? incredible!

>> XFCE was moved to community because of our desire to reduce = the size of
>> the main distribution repository.
>
> it makes sense thanks for the info.. why that are not public in the ne= ws channel at the web page?

Most people enable the community repository as it is.=C2=A0 In most cases,<= br> this is an absolutely boring change.=C2=A0 Therefore there is nothing reall= y
to discuss about it.

>> Many packages in main have been moved
>> over time to community. This is simply because we would like main = to
>> reflect a small core distribution.
> so seems alpine are not for end users.. blind persons cannot install..=
> seems the about page must be updated so.. still said "general pur= pose"

Alpine is for end users who are comfortable with basic system administratio= n
tasks.=C2=A0 It is not an alternative to Ubuntu, Fedora or any of those kin= ds
of distributions.=C2=A0 The primary benefits to using Alpine (lack of syste= md,
musl C library, hardened toolchain, advanced package management) are
really only realized by users who have some pre-existing knowledge.

Considering Alpine is installed using text mode and screen readers work
best in text mode, I suspect that Alpine is actually quite easy for a
blind person to install.

But as I have mentioned, a "user friendly" variant of Alpine may = be good
for somebody to do, much in the way that Ubuntu is a "user friendly&qu= ot; form
of Debian.

>> Alpine largely prefers to stick to the essentials and let downstre= am
>> spins handle things like this.
> umm makes sense.. thaks for that info. so are nto suitable to desktops= end users and daily work?

It is suitable for those who want a proper workstation environment,
and have the capability to bring it up.=C2=A0 Alpine is not intended to be<= br> something like Ubuntu or openSUSE where everything is handled for you.

If you want something with more handholding, Void or Adelie may fill
those niches, but they are only tangentially related to Alpine.

>
>> In some cases, it is beneficial for Alpine to sync
>> up with what downstream consumers are doing, but that isn't a = hard
>> requirement.
> but it's beneficial.. remenber that it's better to grow a litt= le rather than fall into lack of
> manpowers..

It is not necessarily beneficial.=C2=A0 Focusing on desktop is certainly not beneficial to Alpine itself, as we would rather let downstream
spins focus on that.

Ariadne
--000000000000fdaee4059cafd206--